The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management reserves all rights.
Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And that's it. $10 to the winner.
Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
> The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > reserves all rights.
> Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
i am pretty sure i know the answer , but i will let some of the TVSMs take a shot at it
do you have a telephone number or a social security number or an address or a ....
Alim's answer: None of those track my every move
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> The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > reserves all rights.
> Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
You would stand pat if your four-of-a-kind hand was 5s or 10s, and if you had the Joker. Because you hold all of the cards that a competing hand would need to make a straight flush or royal flush, you do not need to draw a card.
DanFan
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> You would stand pat if your four-of-a-kind hand was 5s or 10s, and if you > had the Joker. Because you hold all of the cards that a competing hand > would need to make a straight flush or royal flush, you do not need to > draw a card.
"A" for effort, but would you necessarily want to convey to your opponent that you have a pat hand? I'll admit, this situation is not common, but it is that rare situation that I am looking for. Normally you would want to draw to the hand, not as a means of helping your hand, of course, but as a means of disguising your strength. When would you want to stand PAT to disguise your strength?
> The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > reserves all rights.
> Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
Disclaimer: I have exactly 5 SNGs worth of 5 card draw experience.
In my vast experience I'd say it's a metagame thing. If I was caught trying to stand pat on a bluff (what you kids call snowing), I might try it with quads and then bet it the same as when I bluffed earlier.
However, against you, I'd always draw. I knew you would lead every time if you filled up, had a straight or flush, and sometimes with trips based on me drawing 1. I didn't think you would bet at all if I stood pat. I think drawing gave me more options in that particular hand. Didn't help the whole thing any, but at least that hand there was some sort of lucid thought, lol!
> The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > reserves all rights.
> Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be > the > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. > And > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for > one > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
The question has evolved somewhat since being originally asked, initially you had asked " What would have to happen for him NOT to discard the three?"
To which I answer:
1) When every last one of your OPP's chips go into the pot before the draw.
2) When the 3 had been declare wild (home game) prior to cards being dealt. (how's THAT for outside the box thinking!)
3) When there's some sort of Pat Hand Jackpot being offered.
Barring those 3 scenarios, my answer would be: NEVER. ESPECIALLY not behind an opponent who raps pat - why tip the strength of your hand behind an opponent representing strength? I *hope* he's actually got a hand and isn't trying to snow me, but I'm not tipping him off to the strength of mine until it's too late (for him!)
> The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > reserves all rights.
> Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
Never.
-- Voted RGP's Stupidest Poster on 3/22/09
"ONLY ONE PROBLEM .. The Constitution doesnt have a preamble , but the declaration of Independence does !! YOU JUST CANT MAKE THIS SHIT UP !! :fuck facts ..i have some hate to spread!!" - Constitution scholar K9Way giving RGP the business
"BART [Bay Area Rapid Transit] is rather new." - Jerry Sturdivant chiming in on how little he knows about a train system that's been operational since 1972
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> The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > reserves all rights.
> Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
When you are the opener. no other answer do I have!
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- When you are so drunk that you risk discarding the wrong card - When standing pat will have no effect on the action (e.g. your opponents are all in and have already drawn) - When your fifth card is the bug, and players are drawing so much that a player behind you might get a card from the shuffeled discards - When the second hand on your watch reads between 0 and 2, i.e. approximately 1/6 of the time
I practice I would consider meta-game factors, but I can't write that into a rote set of instructions.
-Patti -- Patti Beadles, Oakland, CA | pattib~pattib.org | All religions are equally http://www.pattib.org/ | ludicrous, and should be ridiculed http://stopshootingauto.com | as often as possible. C. Bond
> > The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > > reserves all rights.
> > Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> > Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> > Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one > > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
> When you are the opener. no other answer do I have!
> - When standing pat will have no effect on the action (e.g. your > opponents are all in and have already drawn) > - When your fifth card is the bug, and players are drawing so much > that a player behind you might get a card from the shuffeled > discards > - When the second hand on your watch reads between 0 and 2, i.e. > approximately 1/6 of the time
> I practice I would consider meta-game factors, but I can't write > that into a rote set of instructions.
> -Patti > -- > Patti Beadles, Oakland, CA | > pattib~pattib.org | All religions are equally > http://www.pattib.org/ | ludicrous, and should be ridiculed > http://stopshootingauto.com | as often as possible. C. Bond
By the way ...Which one is Pink?
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> In my vast experience I'd say it's a metagame thing. If I was caught > trying to stand pat on a bluff (what you kids call snowing), I might try > it with quads and then bet it the same as when I bluffed earlier.
"A" for effort with this, but that's not the direction I'm trying to push this in. Good effort, but no $10. Management reserves all rights.
> However, against you, I'd always draw. I knew you would lead every time > if you filled up,
Try to forget the hand that we actually played which instigated this discussion. I have since changed the premise to a hypothetical Los Angeles-style LIMIT game.
On Mar 10, 3:24 pm, "Paul Popinjay" <paulpopin...@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> Transferred to your account at Stars:
> The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > reserves all rights.
> Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> > The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely > > that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management > > reserves all rights.
> > Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the > > Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily > > relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, > > everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck > > included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
> > Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to > > when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And > > that's it. $10 to the winner.
> > Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night > > arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one > > day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of > > all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's > > out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
> Never.
DING DING DING DING >>>WE HAVE A WINNER< OH WAIT.
Patty has better answerers, see the one about mistakes, A true insight.
> -- > Voted RGP's Stupidest Poster on 3/22/09
> "ONLY ONE PROBLEM .. The Constitution doesnt have a preamble , but the > declaration of Independence does !! YOU JUST CANT MAKE THIS SHIT UP !! > :fuck facts ..i have some hate to spread!!" - Constitution scholar K9Way > giving RGP the business
> "BART [Bay Area Rapid Transit] is rather new." - Jerry Sturdivant chiming > in on how little he knows about a train system that's been operational > since 1972
In article <hn98fc$hu...@news.eternal-september.org>,
Paul Popinjay <paulpopin...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: >> - When the second hand on your watch reads between 0 and 2, i.e. >> approximately 1/6 of the time >No grade for this one. Tantamount to saying that dog ate homework. I'm not >buying it.
It's classic game theory, actually. You want to rap pat some percentage of the time to counteract the times that you will rap pat bluff. It's usually thought of the other way (you want to rap pat bluff some percentage of the time so that your pat hands will get paid off) but I think the consideration goes both ways.
It's not a very big effect in the quads case, but it exists.
-Patti -- Patti Beadles, Oakland, CA | pattib~pattib.org | All religions are equally http://www.pattib.org/ | ludicrous, and should be ridiculed http://stopshootingauto.com | as often as possible. C. Bond
> When you are the opener. no other answer do I have!
Ok, let's entertain this for a moment. You open with dealt quads, and two opponents flat call. Do you really want to stand pat and possibly scare them off of any action after the draw? What if one of your opponents draws three and makes trip Aces? You just stopped him from raising you after the draw, and depending on his temperment and his opinion of you, he might not even call with trip Aces. Nope, sorry, but I'm going to have to reject your answer. Thank you, and better luck next time, sir.
> It's classic game theory, actually. You want to rap pat some > percentage of the time to counteract the times that you will > rap pat bluff. It's usually thought of the other way (you want > to rap pat bluff some percentage of the time so that your pat > hands will get paid off) but I think the consideration goes > both ways.
> It's not a very big effect in the quads case, but it exists.
Thank you, Patti, for explaining "classic game theory" to me. However, BZZZZZT! No prize! Management reserves all rights.
By the way, don't talk down to management next time.
"snex" <snex...@gmail.com> wrote in message news:f8b33924-5866-48ca-99ac- > when you declined to open.
This is actually quite interesting to me, Snex. It's not what I'm looking for, but I would love to hear what you were thinking. Seriously, I would like to hear more from you on this.
On Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:06:00 -0800, "Paul Popinjay"
<paulpopin...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: >"DanFan" <a67c...@webnntp.invalid> wrote in message >news:1jhl67xpb7.ln2@recgroups.com... >> You would stand pat if your four-of-a-kind hand was 5s or 10s, and if you >> had the Joker. Because you hold all of the cards that a competing hand >> would need to make a straight flush or royal flush, you do not need to >> draw a card. >"A" for effort, but would you necessarily want to convey to your opponent >that you have a pat hand? I'll admit, this situation is not common, but it >is that rare situation that I am looking for. Normally you would want to >draw to the hand, not as a means of helping your hand, of course, but as a >means of disguising your strength. When would you want to stand PAT to >disguise your strength?
When it's raise, raise, raise to you, in position, and at least one behind you raps pat on the draw. You hope they have a good enough pat hand to cap the betting when you raise or reraise, assuming that you have a worse pat hand.
> When it's raise, raise, raise to you, in position, and at least one > behind you raps pat on the draw. You hope they have a good enough pat > hand to cap the betting when you raise or reraise, assuming that you > have a worse pat hand.
Ok, I am going to award the $10 grand prize to Man Beaten by Jacks. However, Jacks, please note that more than once I mentioned that the Los Angeles-style game used as a model has NO cap. Just fyi. So, in light of that fact, let's agree that, "if the betting reaches four or more bets, rap pat". The purpose of playing like this is two-fold. First, if you draw one card after going more than four bets before the draw, it raises a red flag that you might actually have quads. That would slow down the action from someone holding a pat full house, and you don't want that. And second, you just hope someone has a full house or makes one after the draw. They might go just a little bit crazy on you with it against your "pat" hand. You have disguised the strength of your hand, when it counts.
And so, I think I can remember your screen name at Stars. Shall I try to send the prize to it?
> "A" for effort with this, but that's not the direction I'm trying to push > this in. Good effort, but no $10. Management reserves all rights.
Yikes, last thing I wanted is another $10 on Stars. Glad I didn't get it right!
> Try to forget the hand that we actually played which instigated this > discussion. I have since changed the premise to a hypothetical Los > Angeles-style LIMIT game.
Ahh yes. Based on my experience in those games I'd say I would rap pat if there were blue elephants flying past the jelly bean beach. That's cause the only way I would be in a LA style limit 5 card draw game would be in some sort of freaky dream.
>> When it's raise, raise, raise to you, in position, and at least one >> behind you raps pat on the draw. You hope they have a good enough pat >> hand to cap the betting when you raise or reraise, assuming that you >> have a worse pat hand.
>Ok, I am going to award the $10 grand prize to Man Beaten by Jacks. >However, Jacks, please note that more than once I mentioned that the Los >Angeles-style game used as a model has NO cap. Just fyi. So, in light of >that fact, let's agree that, "if the betting reaches four or more bets, rap >pat". The purpose of playing like this is two-fold. First, if you draw one >card after going more than four bets before the draw, it raises a red flag >that you might actually have quads. That would slow down the action from >someone holding a pat full house, and you don't want that. And second, you >just hope someone has a full house or makes one after the draw. They might >go just a little bit crazy on you with it against your "pat" hand. You have >disguised the strength of your hand, when it counts.
>And so, I think I can remember your screen name at Stars. Shall I try to >send the prize to it? >Thanks, and congrats, Man Beaten by Jacks!
<paulpopin...@sbcglobal.net> wrote: >Transferred to your account at Stars:
>The format will be similar to the recent Popinjay Blackjack Quiz, namely >that whoever's answer I like best gets the $10 grand prize. Management >reserves all rights.
>Subject today is 5-card Draw, High. The model game is considered to be the >Los Angeles style game, although all particulars are not necessarily >relevant. The game was LIMIT, Jacks-or-better to open, no cap on raises, >everyone antes before the draw, double limit after the draw. 53 card deck >included the joker, good for Aces, straights, and flushes.
>Today's mission is simple. Describe a concise rote instruction as to >when one would stand pat with dealt quads instead of drawing one card. And >that's it. $10 to the winner.
>Disclaimer: Beldin is excluded from this contest. I was up all night >arguing with this braindead freak and I have had enough of his crap for one >day. I don't care even if Beldin were now to provide the best answer of >all, he still doesn't get squat as far as this contest is concerned. He's >out! He can't play. Merry Christmas.
When it's raise, raise, raise to you, in position, and at least one behind you raps pat on the draw. You hope they have a good enough pat hand to cap the betting when you raise or reraise, assuming that you have a worse pat hand.
